Chateau Thelian.jpg[edit source]


DISCUSSION I'm not certain whether this should stay in Château Thelian, but it could definately be used for the Château de Saint Brisson, which it actually is. That's all moot though unless we know how the source feels about the image, and I don't read French. --Chops 01:55, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

I think it's safe to presume that the source doesn't much care, since there are about a billion pictures around. And I want to keep it there because I myself had a hard time imagining what Chateau Thelian might look like until I found this photo, which was coincidently of the Chateau de Saint Brisson, as you noted, the chateau that Articles of the Federation described Chateau Thelian as being similar to. -- Sci 07:39 25 April 2006 UTC

To switch me to a "yes":

  1. Identify the photo as the Château de Saint Brisson, which Thelian is directly compared with. Thelian, however seems to be a composite using features from many châteaux. The photo is thus there more as a sort of "rough sketch" of Thelian than an actual depiction.
  2. Quote the relevant text somewhere on the page, either in the main passage or in a Notes section.
  3. An external links to and (and for the latter, maybe also a link that goes through an online translator)--Emperorkalan 12:30, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
The photo was already identified as actually being of Château de Saint Brisson. The relevent quotations have been added to a "notes" section, and the external links you requested have also been integrated into the notation. -- Sci 17:44 26 April 2006 UTC
Also: I wasn't sure if you were asking that the Articles quotations be added to the image page or to the Château Thelian entry itself. I added the quotation to the image page; please let me know if I misinterpreted your request. -- Sci 17:64 26 April 2006 UTC
Actually, I WAS thinking of it going on the Thelian page, but mostly because I thought (for no particularly good reason) you couldn't do it on the image page. This serves just as well, and with less clutter.--Emperorkalan 19:15, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for your thoroughness. Vote switched (see above)--Emperorkalan 18:52, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
I'm good with this one as is.--Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Is this chateau actually named in the book? If so, the image should be on it's own page, and we can have this pic at the Chateau Thelian with the message "The Chateau is described as strongly resembling..." so-and-so. - Lieutenant Ayala 16:29, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
Click on the image above to get to the page for the image itself. The text from the novel has been quoted in response to a request I made above. Does that affect your suggestion any?--Emperorkalan 16:42, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
Yes, the chateau that that is actually a photo of -- Chateau de Saint Brisson -- is mentioned in Articles. The novel also describes Chateau Thelian as being similar to Chateau de Saint Brisson, hence the use of it as a stand-in for Thelian until/unless a licensed pic comes along. What you suggest has already been done. -- Sci 03:48 30 April 2006 UTC

LasVegas.jpg[edit source]

Image:LasVegas.jpg: Siege of Las Vegas


  • neutral --Chops 01:55, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
  • neutral --Arcarsenal 03:00, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
  • neutral -- Sci 07:39 25 April 2006 UTC
  • neutral --Emperorkalan 12:30, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
  • As the person who chose and uploaded the shot- yes.--Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

DISCUSSION Though it'd be neat to have a sketch of what Vegas under seige would look like, I don't have a problem with this --Chops 01:55, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

  1. Even better if we could get a '60's-era photo, or frame grab from DS9 for the occasional "external" shots of Vic Fontaine's Vegas.--Emperorkalan 12:30, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
I don't think they ever did any such "external" shots, though I may be mistaken. -- Sci 17:53 26 April 2006 UTC
I recall it from somewhere. I'll have to look through "Vic" episodes.--Emperorkalan 19:15, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

I looked for pics from '64, but couldn't find any that were good enough. I figured it would be ok because I was non-specific about the year, simply stating that it was from the "early 21st century", which could conceivably be just a few years before the Siege, which was in 2053.--Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's been nine days now since any votes, and all the tallies are neutral. Should we just allow any images that don't get a clear negative vote? -- Sci 07:32 6 May 2006 UTC

I think it should be assumed Nay if there are no positive votes. That's the way Congress does it, and their always rig-...Well, I think it sounds good... - Lieutenant Ayala 23:14, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure there's a picture in the encyclopedia, so I'll change my vote to no and scan that. There, that solves that problem. --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
Wait a minute, there is a positive vote. Never mind, I've changed my vote back and moving this to "Approved." --Chops 00:03, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

Min zife.jpg[edit source]

Image:Min zife.jpg: Min Zife, Section 31


DISCUSSION First of all, which US president was this? The Bolian makeup throws me. Another distracting thing is that flag, which I could probably remove myself, if need be. --Chops 01:55, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

It's a photoshopped picture of President Eisenhower. I like the image apart from the flag you noted. -- Sci 07:39 25 April 2006 UTC
As long as there's no permission problems, this is altered enough from the original to be the sort of Photoshop job I'd like this site to accept. Although different cropping might be preferable (and using a Fed flag?).--Emperorkalan 12:30, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Could someone explain to me how this image doesn't fall under the definition of "fanon"? It's not a licensed piece of art, and nowhere in any of the licensed fiction is Zife described as looking like Dwight Eisenhower painted blue. It's an invention of a fan, no different from a fanfilm or facfic story, and no less "conjectural" than anything presented in a fanfic or fanfilm, either. -- 22:00, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

If you'll notice, all the pictures here are from unliscenced sources. A few people (at the moment, that constitutes a majority) mentioned that it would improve the asthetics of the wiki to loosen the restrictions on images. Since it was happening anyway, this page was created to oversee the images.
Please feel free to vote and debate on the merits of any picture. Also, any descriptions of Zife would be usefull. All I can find is that he's taller than Azernall, which fits with Eisenhower's height of 5'10". --Chops 00:37, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
That's a large reason for having this discussion page -- what is useful for illustration purposes vs what muddies the waters too much. I don't think a simple Photoshop job such as this is quite in the same category as fanfiction or fanfilm in terms of confusing where licensed characters and events end and where willy-nilly "fanon" begins. Licensed images have an automatic acceptance. Anything else is a judgement call, and should be weighed individually. But if really stands a chance of confusing matters, it should be rejected. It all depends on the individual cases.--Emperorkalan 02:14, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
yes. While its obviously Eisenhower, at least an effort was made to make him a denizen of the 24th century. To me, this is no different from putting a Starfleet uniform on Jorja Fox or Katee Sackoff.--Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

It's been seven days, and it looks like the yeas and the neutrals are even at three to three. Is this a keeper? -- Sci 07:34 6 May 2006 UTC

An additional item: the US Flag in the image was recolored during the original alteration to resemble the Cuban flag, which was seen aboard Kirk's Enterprise in 'The Menagerie' [1]. -- User:Cicero 11:50 6 June 2008 UTC

DTI.gif[edit source]

Image:DTI.gif: Federation Department of Temporal Investigations



Sure, why not?--Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's been seven days since the last vote, and at a vote of five yeas to one neutral, the yeas have it. -- Sci 07:35 6 May 2006 UTC

FNS.jpg[edit source]

Image:FNS.jpg: Federation News Service



I'm just putting this image up here for fairness and completeness' sake. It's a fanon version of the FNS logo taken from a fanfiilm project. I don't mind it and would support its continued being here, but, rules are rules... -- Sci 05:28 27 April 2006 UTC

Again, why not? The article states that it is an artist conception, so I don't have any problems here. The fact that I'm the one who found this pic is irrelevant to my decision (-; --Turtletrekker 08:45, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

  • Do you have a link for the fanfilm? If they created it, it may be copyrighted to them. Also, this looks like it may be from the Star Trek Minutia site... We should source it first. - Lieutenant Ayala 16:29, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
    • Technically, US copyright law holds that the copyright owner of a work that derivitive works such as fanfics or fanfilms are based upon is the legal owner of the copyright of those derivitive works, IIRC. -- Sci 22:22 29 April 2006 UTC
    • There is a link to the page I found this on the FNS articles page.--Turtletrekker 19:41, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Once again, seven days and the yeas are unanimous. -- Sci 07:38 6 May 2006 UTC

Image:Earthp.jpg[edit source]

Image:Earthp.jpg: Earth


  • yes --Chops 19:04, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
  • yes --Sci 20:42 4 May 2006 UTC
  • yes --Emperorkalan 23:20, 4 May 2006 (UTC)


  • No objection to this, but it should go through the same approval process as anything else. --Chops 19:04, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
  • Whoops! I should have submitted it myself; I'm sorry. Anyway, obviously, I'd vote to keep, what with my having submitted it and all. -- Sci 20:43 4 May 2006 UTC
  • Well, it's been seven days and it looks like the yeas have it. -- Sci 01:50 12 May 2006 UTC

Image:Paris.jpg[edit source]

Image:Paris.jpg: Paris


  • yes --Sci 22:06 4 May 2006 UTC
  • yes --Emperorkalan 23:20, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
  • no --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)


Found this photo of Paris I had uploaded from Wikipedia and thought I'd go ahead and submit it for approval. The creator of the photo granted persmission for its distribution and copying. -- Sci 22:06 4 May 2006 UTC

I don't see why we need this. The matte painting has both of the most important buildings in 24th-century Paris. --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's been seven days and it looks like the yeas have it. -- Sci 18:14 12 May 2006 UTC

Image:Place_de_la_Concrode.jpg[edit source]

Image:Place_de_la_Concorde.jpg: Palais de la Concorde


  • yes -- Sci 22:12 4 May 2006 UTC
  • yes --Emperorkalan 23:20, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
  • neutral --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)


I uploaded this photo, taken by a user on the TrekBBS going by the name of "Rosalind," with Rosalind's permission, to give Memory Beta's users a better idea of what the Place de la Concorde -- and thus the immediate vicinity of the Palais -- looks like in real life. -- Sci 22:12 4 May 2006 UTC

It looks rather dreary next to the matte painting, but it's a cool idea. --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's been seven days and it looks like the yeas have it. -- Sci 18:14 12 May 2006 UTC

Image:TzenkethiCoalition.gif[edit source]

Image:emblem.gif: Tzenkethi Coalition, Autarch of the Tzenkethi Coalition


  • yea -- Sci 07:39 6 May 2006 UTC
  • yes --Emperorkalan 07:56, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
  • yes --Chops 23:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)


Yet another fanon supplemental image that has escaped submission for approval up until now. I like it, I added it, and there's no canonical emblem of the Tzenkethi Coalition that I'm aware of, so I vote yea. -- Sci 07:40 6 May 2006 UTC

As long as it's listed as conjectural, OK. Naturally, if forthcoming licensed works show or describe any such symbol and it conflicts with this one, it should be removed, whether a replacement is available or not.--Emperorkalan 07:56, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's been seven days and it looks like the yeas have it. -- Sci 18:14 12 May 2006 UTC

BridgeOverAPoolOfWaterLilies.jpg[edit source]

BridgeOverAPoolOfWaterLilies.jpg: Palais de la Concorde Monet Room



I grabbed this off the net somewhere. Don't remember where. I put it up there because that's the painting described as hanging in the Monet Room in Articles; I had been curious about what that painting looked like and thought it would be a nice thing to put up there for other folks wondering that. I think, though I may be mistaken, that the painting's in the public domain. -- Sci 21:26 7 May 2006 UTC

If it's mentioned in the book, and this is the painting, then it should be on here, so I don't think we'd need to vote. - Lieutenant Ayala 16:03, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

A week's gone by and the yeas are unanimous. -- Sci 02:25 22 May 2006 UTC

Borg.jpg[edit source]

Borg.jpg: Borg, Borg Drone, Borg implants, Borg Collective


  • yes --Chops 23:50, 7 May 2006 (UTC), modified --Chops 03:59, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
  • no --8of5 02:10, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
  • yes--Emperorkalan 11:47, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
  • yes--Turtletrekker 10:54, 14 May 2006 (UTC)


While it's based on canon, this picture's design has been spiffied up. I'll scan the ST Encyclopedia's version to replace it. --Chops 23:50, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

Actually I think its a scan from the Star Trek: Starcharts (p79 if you have it), that said its not the best scan in the world and could do with a better crop so if the encylopedia's version is abit neater go for it. -- 8of5 02:10, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

This isn't a supplemental image (defined as an image that's created by a non-licensed/non-canonical source). Therefore, the discussion over this image -- which is a representation of the canonical Borg design seen numerous times in both licensed sources and in TNG itself -- should be in the deletion page. -- Sci 02:45 8 May 2006 UTC

I withdraw my objection. I didn't realize it was from Star Charts. I can't seem to find my encyclopedia, so I can't even scan a new one. --Chops 03:55, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

The symbol itself is known, so votings unrequired, but can we get a better one? To match the other Species Insignia we have, with a white background. - Lieutenant Ayala 16:03, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

A week gone by and the yeses have it. -- Sci 02:25 22 May 2006 UTC

StarfleetIntelligence.JPG[edit source]

image removed from all pages, not needed... VOTES


Another one that's escaped our notice. --Chops 02:30, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm not fond of that symbol in the middle at all. Wasn't a Starfleet Intel. logo given, and it was just about the same as the Starfleet with a different phrase around an outer ring? And I'd like to note my continued diapproval that this logo would be on half of those pages to begin with :-) - Lieutenant Ayala 16:03, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Well, that you can change without a vote. If someone really cares about it, they'll let you know. --Chops 18:53, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

It's been a week and it looks like the yeas win by two to one. -- Sci 02:25 22 May 2006 UTC

No offense to the creator but we now have two valid licensed SI logo images from books, so this one has been orphaned. -- Captain MKB 17:49, June 13, 2010 (UTC)

Gerda Asmund[edit source]

Original picture of Idun Asmund.


DISCUSSION I should've remembered this one earlier. I photoshopped the image of Idun Asmund from the cover of Reunion into an "artist conception" of her twin sister Gerda. The twins are described as being indistinguishable from each other with exception of Idun (also pictured) always wearing her hair down and Gerda always wearing her hair in a bun.--Turtletrekker 10:50, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

This is one of the few that have been on here that I think are actually good, and would probably let pass even if we didn't have "supp images."so nice job. - Lieutenant Ayala 16:03, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Agreed. Very nice job! --Chops 18:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm guessing that Lieutenant Ayala voted on this one same time as the others; therefore, it's been a week and the yeses have it. -- Sci 02:25 22 May 2006 UTC

GornHegemony.gif[edit source]



Yet another conjectural emblem that has escaped our attention. This one is from Star Trek Minutiae. I'm not aware of any Gorn emblems from licensed sorces, so I say yea. -- Sci 03:16 22 May 2006 UTC

Not because I disagree with anything in it, but isn't there a "non-canon" /canon (as in, it was seen in a game somewhere, not just fan made) logo? I think the Gorn had an insignia on "Star Trek: Starfleet Command" or some computer game. But if we can't find it, this would serve as a great temp logo. - Lieutenant Ayala 20:35, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm not aware of any non-canonical licensed Gorn emblems. Let us know if you see one. -- Sci 21:11 24 May 2006 UTC

It's been eight days and the yeas are unanimous. -- Sci 00:38 2 June 2006 UTC

Agreed. Image approved.--The Doctor 06:47, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Pre-emptive voting on Titan character sketches[edit source]

I was planning on contacting Christopher L. Bennett and asking if he minded if we used his sketches from his website for some USS Titan characters that he created, but I figure I might save myself some aggrivation later on by running them past the community beforehand. These are links to his sketches...


2006 (UTC)


They are sketches made by the creator of the characters in question. What more do we need?--Turtletrekker 07:00, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Great sketches. Not exactly how I pictured the characters, but I like. And I think Torvig looks cute. :) -- The Doctor 07:44, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
If their by the original author, then it doesn't seem to be a problem at all. - Lieutenant Ayala 20:35, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

BTW, Christopher replied to my mail today and he has no objections to our using the drawings. Despite the outcome seeming obvious, I will wait for voting to finish before uploading them.--Turtletrekker 06:41, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

It's been eight days and the yeas are unanimous. -- Sci 00:38 2 June 2006 UTC

Al-Rashid.jpg[edit source]

Al-Rashid.jpg: Presidential Transport, President of the United Federation of Planets.



I created this image of the al-Rashid, one of the three presidential shuttles established in Articles of the Federation, by taking a jpg of the Enterprise-E shuttle from Star Trek: Insurrection and a jpg of Admiral Janeway's shuttle from "Endgame" and using MS Paint (I am primitive, I know) to transfer the Federation emblem and individual letters from the Janeway shuttle to the Enterprise shuttle. Anyone mind this image? -- Sci 00:42 2 June 2006 UTC

Yes. It looks different enough, but still within the Starfleet design aesthetic as we've seen it thus far.--Julianbaischir 15:30, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
Well its been 5 months since the image was posted and the overall vote is yes, so image approved.--The Doctor 21:21, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

No Translator[edit source]

No Translator.jpg

I made this to illustrate a scene in the novel Devil in the Sky based on the same sort of communications used by the Horta in The Devil in the Dark. --8of5 10:32, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

  • Yes--8of5 10:32, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 17:08, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 07:15, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Illumination of The Prodigal[edit source]

Illumination of The Prodigal.jpg

I made this to illustrate a scene in the novel Devil in the Sky, made from three screencaps, the starscape and DS9 from Emissary and the planetoid Vandor IV from We'll Always Have Paris. --8of5 02:08, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

  • Yes--8of5 02:08, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 17:09, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 07:15, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Kobayashi Maru teaser cover[edit source]

EnterpriseKM l.jpg

User:JDB uploaded this cover, which as far as I can tell is the author's, presumably unofficial, teaser for the novel. I've emailed Andy Mangels to check for permission, so while we await that we should pass it through the supplemental images vote. I'm for keeping it as a stand in until an offical one is realeased and then either move it down to the information section or delete it. --8of5 21:32, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Ok we have permision now, but we've been asked not to post the translation of the Romulan text (which I can't even find). --8of5 22:45, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

  • Yes--8of5 21:32, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--Emperorkalan 00:29, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 00:57, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 07:15, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Starship Images[edit source]

Following the debarkle I made with images for the Larson-class, I figured I should do this through the right channels this time.

It would be nice to have images for several starship classes from the TOS era as featured in FASA or the Star Fleet Technical Manual. There are several CGI images for the Saladin-class, Hermes-class, the Federation-class and the Loknar-class on this page on

So pending the correct permission from the images creator, should these images be included on the wiki?


  • Yes --The Doctor 21:14, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Yes - Conditionally -- 8of5 01:25, 15 November 2006 (UTC)


I'd say yes, but with only if there is not a licensed alternative. We are meant to be chronicling licensed sources, seems silly to outright ignore one just because we can find a prettier version elsewhere. -- 8of5 01:25, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 05:31, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Statueofliberty.jpg[edit source]


I added this Statue of Liberty image, which was from the U.S Government National Park Service web site. The only image I could find of the statue from a licensed source that I have access to is from the Enterprise episode Storm Front where it's in the background of films showing the alternate timeline version of Hitler visiting New York City. As far as I know that's the only time the statue ever appears in a Trek related movie or TV offering. If there's one from a comic book that I don't have access to, I would hope someone could upload the image. Servo 15:47, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

Discussion[edit source]

If we have an in-universe shot I think we should use it, which we do Image:AdolfHitler1944.jpg, even if it is a fuzzy background shot. I feel supplemental images should only be used when there is absolutely no alternative. And don't forget to vote yourself Servo. --8of5 16:28, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Agreed... speaking of, do we have a policy on "real-life" information? This is an example; the Statue of Liberty page includes some information on the statue that I would imagine was never addressed by any Trek source. -- Data Noh 20:28, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
Might be one of those not written down ones, but yes we do, keep it to a bare mininium, what is assumed knowledge for whatever reference in-universe it does have. Servo has something of a passion for extranious real world info. --8of5 22:06, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Why not? Have fun! --Turtletrekker 22:53, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Because there is a perfectly good image in-universe, already on the site no less. --8of5 22:57, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
The Hitler pic? Perfectly good? Grainy and black-and-white? Sorry, I respectfully disagree. --Turtletrekker 23:17, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
ETA: Furthermore, and this not the nerdie Trekkie in me talking but the sappy patriot, I intensely dis-like the association of Hitler and the Statue of Liberty. I find it... disturbing. I have no objection to the pic being on the page with the proper context given, but not as the main image. The statue means something to Americans and to have that man's image in pic that we use to depict the statue itself is just wrong. *steps down from soapbox* --Turtletrekker 00:04, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
*rolls eyes and mutters something about patriotic americans* As you said in a post above yourself this is a fictional universe, and Hitler in front of the Statue of Liberty is part of that universe, and until someone finds an image in a comic or something, the only in-universe image of the statue. If it's really that important to you there could always be a second cropped version of the image without Hitler. --8of5 01:15, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
Actually, nothing here is that important to me. Nothing here is truly important at all, in any way. Important to us perhaps, but not in the grand scheme. Which is why I scratch my head over this need to only use licensed images for real world objects. It just doesn't matter.
Anyway, I'm was just stating my opinion. I was under the impression that that was what "discussions" were for. You want to take another cheap pot-shot at my patriotism, you go right ahead. I may hate my "president" and what he's doing in Iraq (and everything else he is/isn't doing for that matter), but I'll always love my home. --Turtletrekker 01:56, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
Ok in this case, given I'm arguing for an image as shown in the 20th century you might be right, in general though real world bits of earth to show what is usually 22nd 23rd or 24th century earth is all wrong to me. But meh, whatever, you've voted, I've voted, whatever wins wins. And of course you have every right to express your opinion just as I have mine, but this is not the place for such debate, whatever our political (or cultural) beliefs, they're irrelevant here. --8of5 02:10, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
I'm not especially bothered by the Hitler connotations myself, but I can easily imagine a lot of people who would be. Although it's not our job to take into account the real-universe connotations of the Trek universe, I think we would be well-advised to consider people's feelings. While an in-universe picture is preferable, the Hitler image isn't even from the primary "Trek" timeline, so its value is arguable. I say keep this picture, although be on the lookout for an in-universe one we can replace it with. -- Data Noh 02:28, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Unbelievable. Are you people really going to be this anal about a real-world photo of a real world monument? And, seeing as this is the non-canon wiki, and that the majority of the Statue of Liberty article is drawn from non-canon prose, I don't see the existance of a canon pic as a relevant point for or against this one. Frankly, if I had the choice, I would get the hell rid of all the damned pics altogether, but if we have to have them, I'd rather have aestetically-pleasing pics than fuzzy, blurry, zoomed-and-cropped canon pics. --Seventy 02:12, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Well stick your yes vote on and if no one else bothers to vote it's in. --8of5 02:15, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, why not, let's go wild and have fun like the old days!!!!!!!! --Dr. John Smith 03:38, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Wow. This actually has been fun. Not very productive, but... cleansing. --Turtletrekker 08:01, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Approved: 4-1 for keeping it.--Jdvelasc 05:31, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

US ranks[edit source]

My renditions adapted from public domain insignia, many of these have been seen in canon or non-canon, the rest we can divine were used based on our knowledge of "real-life". -- Captain MKB 21:49, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

I voted yes, but that is on the assumption we actually need all or most of them, not a lot of point having them all about if we only need one or two. --8of5 21:56, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
I know that 6 are relevant to canon from their use on MA. Many will be relevant to the known ranks of various 'real-world' figures mentioned in non-canon. Any provably not really usable on MB can be deleted i think. -- Captain MKB 22:03, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

  • Yes--Captain MKB 21:49, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--8of5 21:56, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 19:17, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 05:31, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Miranda Kadohata[edit source]

Image removed

Submitted by user:Cicero. -- Captain MKB 13:05, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Artist's conception based on author Keith R. A. DeCandido's suggestion of Stephanie Chaves-Jacobsen as an appropriate actor for the character (concurred with by author Christopher L. Bennett, who also remarked that she was perhaps a decade too young).
(Both comments were made in the message board thread 'Cast the Characters of Trek Literature' at -- user:Cicero

Despite having author approval I don't think it's a good idea to visualise things we don't have a pre-existing imagery of - eg we shouldn't make up character/starship designs based only on descriptions, our imaginations, and the whim of which actor we might cast in that part. (Plus I agree with Christopher, she looks a little young for Kadohata) --8of5 14:29, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

A little young, but I don't see the harm so long as it's marked as a supplemental image. I like the creativity involved, and it's a very good photoshop. -- Sci
Speaking as Kadohata's creator, I think the image is perfect. And as long as it's billed as a supplemental image, I don't see the harm. -- KRAD, 26 May 2008
I don't mind the picture. Yes, Jacobsen is roughly ten years younger than Kadohata, but she certainly fits other characteristics: Asian with a British accent.– Enterprise1981 20:41, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
Like KRAD, I don't see the harm in adding supplemental images. Pictures can be very helpful with visualization when reading (and help in remembering details) and they make the wiki a lot more attractive. We should be careful with this and make sure that we vote on images, but if the image fits (as decided by us) then go for it. In this case, I think it fits well enough. --Jdvelasc 19:57, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
These days, I tend to avoid votes like this for various reasons, but I really like this "casting" and the image both. In fact, the other day, while talking about BSG: Razor with a friend, I actually referred to Chaves-Jacobsen's character as "Miranda". LOL! And just so I can be the fourth person in a row to say it, I don't see the harm. --Turtletrekker 00:26, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
I'm more afraid of the precedent we'll be setting with some other editor choosing a character for a photoshop based on their own personal casting ideas (re: Min Zife Eisenhower). I think we should be clear this decision was made to honor an author's opinion, and not a fan's.
I am flattered however at someone who is the same age as be having been described as being "too young" for anything. -- Captain MKB 09:35, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
  • No--8of5 14:29, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
  • No--Seventy 00:36, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--Sci 00:13 26 MAY 2008 UTC
  • Yes--KRAD 15:05 26 MAY 2008 EST
  • Yes--The Doctor 19:17, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--JDB 19:49, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 19:57, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--Cicero 23:09 27 May, 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--Turtletrekker 00:26, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

Approved: 7-2 for keeping it eight days after the last vote.--Cicero 13:10, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Odo and Laas by the Great Link[edit source]

Odo and Laas

I made this to illustrate a little scene in Avatar, and I think we might be able to use it for something in The Dominion: Olympus Descending too at some point. It's made from screencaps from "What You Leave Behind" and "Chimera". I basically removed Kira from the scene with Odo, and added in Laas.

  • Yes --8of5 05:12, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Sci 00:13 26 MAY 2008 UTC
  • Yes --JDB 19:50, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes--Jdvelasc 19:57, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Approved: No votes against it.--Jdvelasc 13:43, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Starship Images[edit source]

Following the debarkle I made with images for the Larson-class, I figured I should do this through the right channels this time.

It would be nice to have images for several starship classes from the TOS era as featured in FASA or the Star Fleet Technical Manual. There are several CGI images for the Saladin-class, Hermes-class, the Federation-class and the Loknar-class on this page on

So pending the correct permission from the images creator, should these images be included on the wiki?


  • Yes --The Doctor 21:14, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Yes - Conditionally -- 8of5 01:25, 15 November 2006 (UTC)


I'd say yes, but with only if there is not a licensed alternative. We are meant to be chronicling licensed sources, seems silly to outright ignore one just because we can find a prettier version elsewhere. -- 8of5 01:25, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

The discussion is over. --Jdvelasc 14:00, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Aventine/Vesta[edit source]

USS Aventine have today released the first concept art by Mark Rademaker for the official design of the Vesta-class/USS Aventine. The final design will be used on novels and in the Ships of the Line calendars. As this isn't the final or from an actual publication I thought we'd need to clear it here... It will for now be useful as a stand-in image for the Aventine and Vesta pages, and once we have a final image will be useful as background info on the evolution of the design. --8of5 18:34, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Yes--8of5 18:34, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Yea--Sci 19:29 31 DEC 2008 UTC
  • YesCicero 06:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

DeathTongue[edit source]

It has previously been noted that DeathTongue may be a reference to something that appeared in a comic strip, this was noted as background information and an image of the entire band is on the talk page. That is interesting and appropriate, I don't feel it so to take the logo from that comic and, without any indication from the author that there is any connection at all, allocate it to the trekverse band. It might be appropriate to move the whole band image into the main article within the background section, it seems wrong to make up any actually connection between the two. -- 8of5 23:05, 19 April 2007 (UTC)


Since the comic strip reference is apparently deemed relevant enough to include in a footnote on the page itself, I figured the band logo from the strip (the only image that would be available) would be equally relevant. I don't really see this as any less accurate than the community-accepted fanon logos we use for various organizations (such as the FNS), unless there are copyright issues of which I am unaware (if there are, I'm up for immediately deleting this). -- Data Noh 23:17, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Thing is, we do have "any indication from the author" -- Dayton Ward's story annotations -- which is linked to directly from the "Almost... But Not Quite" article. I'm mystified as to why this is now suddenly the standard of image acceptability, since to the best of my knowledge, David Mack has never said Min Zife looks anything like Eisenhower. --Seventy 23:25, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

I refer the naysayers to Dayton Ward's Annotations.
"Page 261: "DeathTongue." A reference to a Sunday edition of the great "Bloom County" comic strip. "DeathTongue" was the name of a band that Bill the Cat and company formed, a precursor to the more mainstream "Billy and the Boingers." I have their first album up for auction on eBay."

Data Noh: Well the difference is acknowledging where a name came from (as the annotations do) and saying they are one in the same is very different, if the band in the trekverse and Bill the Cats band are meant to be one in the same then fine, but that wasn't clear from the previous note, it was just random connection.

And Seventy I quite agree, if I'd have been involved when alot of our supplimental images were suggested I'd have voted against. We dont need author approval, but we also shouldnt make unnesisary jumps, the annotations confirm the link, I accept that, but without that it was just two fictional bands that happened to share a name. -- 8of5 00:14, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Klingon-Cardassian Alliance Emblem[edit source]


Discussion[edit source]

Looks good to me - assuming we have the artist's permission. --Jdvelasc 05:18, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Votes[edit source]

  • Yes --Jdvelasc 05:18, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Series of Star Fleet divisional emblems[edit source]

Starfleet Intelligence.

Starfleet Marines.

The FASA RPG introduced a system of small divisional emblems for different parts of "Star Fleet" -- many were only seen as clip art obscured by text.

I have redrawn some and added them to the FASA Star Fleet seal, as described in the books, as how the divisional emblems would have been shown, with the text altered to reflect the division in question.

The first of which was the Starfleet Intelligence logo, I have also prepared one based on their SFMC insignia.

Since these are based on images from the non-canon source materials themselves, with only rearrangement and cosmetic removal of markup and text, I think they are fairly elementary additions. -- Captain MKB 18:27, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Bit late... but sounds good to me :) --8of5 04:34, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
Add another late yes.--Emperorkalan 12:43, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Kadohata replacement[edit source]

Replacement candidate

New Photoshop

Per request by User:Cicero lets do this formally: I propose the existing supplemental illustration of Miranda Kadohata be replaced with this new one. While I personally oppose having an image based on fantasy casting at all, if we are to have it I feel it should at least be a decent image and feel the original is a very poor, messy and unattractive illustration. --8of5 06:39, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I don't think there's presently any mechanism in place to vote to remove a previously approved image, except by replacement. Given my track record, of course, I could be wrong.--Cicero 07:00, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I'm not aware of one either (suppose you could nominate for deletion, but that would seem to ignore the fact it's already been voted in), otherwise I'd have nominated the removal of several supplemental images :P --8of5 07:04, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I've noticed that images can fairly consistently count on your "no" vote. :p--Cicero 07:06, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

When viewed at its full resolution, several problems are apparent in the image rendered for replacement. The new image is very highly saturated, particularly at the uniform collar and in the background, but also on the actor's face. The male shoulder structure of the base uniform images is apparent, and contributes (with the aforementioned saturation difference, and some sharp edges) to a poor match between body and head in the image. Oddly, she also looks considerably younger in the latter image for some reason. Perhaps because of the more youthful vibrant colors? Given that Kadohata has been described as at least a decade older in appearance than Ms. Chaves-Jacobsen, and additionally youthful-looking image is somewhat inappropriate.

Further, the collar and neck angles don't match in the suggested new image, nor does the lighting between them match. (This problem notably marred the cover to Titan: The Red King.)--Cicero 07:06, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I don't agree the image is over saturated, or that the colour is in any way detrimental. Now you mention the shoulders though they did seem a little too slumped so I've adjusted those. --8of5 07:34, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
It's not so much slumping that's the problem so much as a difference in shape between male and female shoulders. The forward angle of the O'Brien image hides this somewhat, but overall males' shoulders rise differently from females'. If you'd really like a different image (I just now noticed that the other is fairly small), I'd be happy to see if I can find some Chaves-Jacobsen and Dax (there aren't many choices besides those two) pictures in which the positions and lighting generally match. We could see if we could produce something relatively large with consistent resolution and appropriate matching.--Cicero 07:40, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Knock yourself out, if you can deliver a better alternative I welcome it. My issue with the current version is it's a plain messy image, you pick at the details of the new version yet seem blind to the general low quality of the old. --8of5 07:43, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

...anyone gunna swing this vote. The principle of having the image is already approved, we just need to figure out which picture is better. --8of5 07:28, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

No offense to the creators of either of the images, but they both clearly look like 'shops to me. The newer one has a bit more "fuzz" around the edges where the uniform and background and head pieces all meet up; the original isn't great, but the smaller size seems to hide some of the imperfections. Assuming the yes/no vote is for the replacement, then I vote no; if I've misunderstood the vote, then mine is considered null/void. --Captain Savar 04:17, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Well I only created my version because the original is so irritatingly bad to me; the background and that weird black blob at the bottom annoy the hell out of me. If you're looking at them up close, sure the neck/uniform line on the new one is slightly fuzzy, but it's sort of bumpy on old version, very rough! Also keep in mind these are primarily used in the sidebar, so will both be displayed at the same smaller width. Also I'd note the new version has the correct department colour! And visible rank. --8of5 21:50, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

In fact, I'd say the old one is a candidate for deletion or nominable for disapproval because of the incorrect information used in its creation -- Captain MKB 21:59, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
I agree that the current image should be replaced. It's so dark that it's hard to make out. Since Cicero hasn't offered an alternative, what about one of the two images to the right? One is the original image brightened (the blob in the picture appears to be a chair), the other is a new photoshop from Razor. --Columbia clipper 02:32, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
Just for clarification, who photoshopped the newest image here? -- Captain MKB 04:57, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
I did. Should I have marked that somewhere?--Columbia clipper 14:05, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
In the image itself preferably -- i just wanted to make sure we knew where it was coming from.
I just noticed the amorphous dark shapes and smears along the left side, making me question the effectiveness of the image -- they are distracting. Would Columbia Clipper be averse to providing the source images so this defect could be corrected, or be willing to do this him/herself? -- Captain MKB 22:30, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
The splotches aren't visible on my computer, even on maximum brightness; I had to check my phone to see what you were talking about. I think I've cleared them, but, as I said, I can't really see them on my computer. How does the image look now? --Columbia clipper 07:33, November 22, 2009 (UTC)
Looks OK to me, but then I'm looking at the newest version. I'll have to leave it to Mike to comment on the improvement vis the splotches. I do think this shot has much better lighting than the version currently used, and makes her look more like a mature officer, less like a kid in front of a campfire.--Emperorkalan 08:13, November 25, 2009 (UTC)
Splotches fixed, amen. -- Captain MKB 12:27, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

  • Yes - to replace; No - to having either image at all --8of5 06:39, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
  • No--Cicero 07:00, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
  • No for replacing, keep old --Captain Savar 04:17, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
  • Yes - to replacement with either brightened image or new photoshop --Columbia clipper 02:32, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
  • Yes - to replace -- preferring the new photoshop -- Captain MKB 04:24, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
  • Yea for new photoshop. -- Sci 04:04 18 NOV 2009 UTC
  • Yes on New Photoshop. --Emperorkalan 08:13, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

Scene from TNG - Double Helix novel: Quarantine[edit source]

Riker preparing to leave the USS Gandhi.

Photoshop I had done with TNG screencaps showing Tom Riker preparing to leave the USS Gandhi for the last time. In the book he had stepped into a role as a medical courier to avoid the wrath of an angry senior officer and went on a mission that would lead him to meet with, and join, the Maquis. -- Captain MKB 13:47, October 26, 2009 (UTC)

Where would this be used? And more out of curiosity: What's been edited? --8of5 23:55, October 28, 2009 (UTC)
In the summary of Quarantine. It's been edited to have a larger background, and to show Riker in a blue uniform. Also, the shuttle registry. -- 00:06, October 29, 2009 (UTC)
Sounds good to me. --8of5 20:35, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

File:R Desai.JPG[edit source]

Reworked version

This is an image I made of Captain Rana Desai for my own amusement. It features 34 year-old actor Parminder K. Nagra as the character, who was suggested by David Mack in his annotations for Vanguard: Harbinger. The image comes from the transporter room (which has an unfortunately black wall) in Dagger of the Mind. --Columbia clipper 01:54, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

Did I not code that right? I don't see the picture, just a box. --Columbia clipper 01:55, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
Nevermind. All is well. --Columbia clipper 02:58, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I really like the composition of the image but the merging of the two images is very obvious, especially where the two areas of hair don’t mesh. Taking your lead I used the same and/or very similar source images to recreate the image. I've merged the hair so it works together, avoided the slight humpback impression the shoulder/neckline gives and took the liberty of removing the transporter light and tricorder strap. And so long as we use the newer version I vote yes, as we have a precedent for fantasy casting and this is a nice looking image. --8of5 05:07, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I like your improved version, it's much nicer. I have one caveat - her hair. Would it be possible to include the longer hairstyle seen in the first image, which Nagra wore in Compulsion?

I used this image from Compulsion, which given the identical expression I believe must be the same one you used. And as you can see her hair is tied up and back quite tightly. By combining her hair with Helen Noel from the uniform source image it's already given her hair the impression of greater volume, as Noel's style is less tight. But neither source image features long hair. --8of5 05:21, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I was referring to the bun style of the Compulsion image. I hadn't realized what her hair looked like when the image was brightened. What I was going for was something like the new image titled "illustrative version" - long hair that's up. I think that's how she's described in the books. -- Columbia clipper 06:19, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
I really appreciate your effort, by the way. Most people wouldn't take the time to track down the same sources to recompose an image. And the result looks great. -- Columbia clipper 06:19, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I had initially thought that Nagra looked too young for Desai, but author David Mack said he really likes the image. It is truly wonderful work. I'd suggest that we use the "Reworked Version" rather than the "Illustrative Version," as Nagra's hair in the "Illustrative Version" (and in the original "Suggested Image") does not look quite real. -- Sci 13:25 30 NOV 2009 UTC

Glad you like guys. Tracking down the images is the easy bit, as you (Columbia) were good enough to clearly explain where all the bits came from finding them was a doddle (good ol' TrekCore), and reworking an already successful composition is much easier than hunting out different elements to start from scratch.
Anywho, the hair. I can see where you're coming from, but hair I find rather tricky to piece together from several different elements, so if I were going to change it I'd swap out the hair for another source image all together. Which would mean finding an appropriate source image with the hair in the proposed style that would work with this image. And given I think the image is working rather well, and looks like it's long hair tied back anyway (just not as tight as the original Nagra image) I'm happy to leave it as it is. --8of5 16:47, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
Oh one question: I followed Columbia clipper's lead, but just to check; that is an appropriate insignia for this character and posting right? --8of5 16:48, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
Yes, Vanguard: Harbinger describes the "starburst" insignia as being beside the number painted on the station's hull. --Columbia clipper 17:07, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
  • Yes --8of5 05:07, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
  • Yes --Columbia clipper 05:11, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
  • Yes, absolutely great work. --The Doctor 10:30, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
  • Yea to the Reworked Version -- Sci 13:25 30 NOV 2009 UTC
  • Yes on the Reworked Version --Emperorkalan 01:53, December 1, 2009 (UTC)

In case this image ever come up for discussion again (see Kadohata replacement, above), it should be noted that my impression of Desai's hair in the books was inaccurate. It's described twice, first in "Harbinger":
Like many of her contemporaries, Desai wore her raven hair in a stylish but simple bob cut.
then in Summon the Thunder:
Her black hair was cut in a short style that kept it free of her face, and once again Reyes found himself drawn to her high, smooth cheekbones, delicate nose, and narrow chin, made all the more attractive by her choosing not to apply cosmetics.
The second passage could easily describe her hair in this image. Again, great work. --Columbia clipper 21:58, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Mirror badge[edit source]

Mirror badge .JPEG.

Mirror badge .SVG.

Depiction of the badge worn by the mirror crew in the DC Comics storyline, created by tracing and digitally coloring images of the mirror logo and the 2280s starfleet logo. -- Captain MKB 05:56, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Neat! --8of5 14:24, August 30, 2010 (UTC)
I want to be picky - especially since you've done such a nice job - but is that the right Terran Empire symbol? It looks like the ENT logo, not the TOS one. --Archimedean 19:51, September 13, 2010 (UTC)
Interesting Freudian slip in your comment -- I assume you meant "I don't want to be picky".
I don't see if it matters which image was used as a source since the Terran pins in the comic were pretty much crudely drawn. My interpretation was created using the one that showed more detail of Earth, if you must know. - Captain MKB 20:00, September 13, 2010 (UTC)
That issue did occur to me when the image was first added, I checked through all the comics and couldn't find one example of the logo drawn with enough detail to determine which version of Earth was used so didn't bother to raise the issue. The closest to this we have from another source is the recent IDW TNG Mirror Images issue, which featured the movie era uniforms but used the TOS era dagger-Earth symbol rather than modifying it into the movie-era badge design. I think an Americas focus globe would better reflect the era as we know it, but, we also don't have an example to prove that should be the case, so I'm happy to support the image in its current format (though if the other version was to appear I'd be even happier ;) --8of5 20:29, September 13, 2010 (UTC)
Unfortunately I won't have access to Photoshop for a while so changes aren't immediately possible -- I'm fine with leaving this as is for my reasons stated. -- Captain MKB 20:33, September 13, 2010 (UTC)

Oops. Yes, I meant don't. I originally wrote "don't mean to be", but must have deleted "don't" when I changed "mean" to "want". --Archimedean 01:52, September 14, 2010 (UTC)

Nice work. I'll refrain from voting to avoid restarting the clock on approval. (I've added the accurate timestamp and signature to Archimedean's post above, both taken from the edit history). --Columbia clipper 18:19, October 16, 2010 (UTC)
I'm in no hurry, Clipper -- i'll take that as a yes vote also...
I've toyed with an .SVG version, not sure how it compares (i did a straight raster-vector conversion, so it's not the cleanest but i didn't feel like starting from scratch ((also why i'm not rushing to change the continents))) -- Captain MKB 15:05, February 26, 2011 (UTC)

The Anatomy Lesson of Dr. Nicolaes Tulp[edit source]

Rembrandt's "The Anatomy Lesson of Dr. Nicolaes Tulp"


This image was used by John Byrne as the inspiration for his cover for Leonard McCoy, Frontier Doctor, Issue 4. I believe therefore that it would be useful to include the image in that article for the sack of comparison. --8of5 17:57, October 16, 2010 (UTC)


I took this version of the image from Chris Ryall's blog, where he explained the connection. It is a digital version of the original Rembrandt painting, of sufficient resolution and quality for our purposes that I felt no need to source an alternate version. --8of5 17:57, October 16, 2010 (UTC)


Optimum Movement Banner[edit source]

Optimal banner.

Depiction of the banner used by the Optimum Movement. This is an original illustration of a canon topic, the logo appeared in different versions in "Encounter at Farpoint" and "All Good Things" -- this started out hand drawn and was digitally colored so it won't match the art Paramount used, but no publication (that I know of) has ever depicted the original art, so there's no way to make any precise corrections/comparisons. The name "Optimum Movement" is derived from the TOS novel Federation, which describes that this was the authority over the post atomic court seen in canon. -- Captain MKB 14:19, February 26, 2011 (UTC)

  • yes -- Captain MKB 16:27, February 27, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- 8of5 08:40, March 5, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- The Doctor 10:01, March 5, 2011 (UTC)

Terran Empire icons[edit source]

These two images are both Terran Empire icons, one based on the other. They are both old, but again, they were never brought up for approval. --Long Live the United Earth (talk) 22:34, February 13, 2017 (UTC)


  • Approve--Long Live the United Earth (talk) 22:34, February 13, 2017 (UTC)
  • keep full size, delete icon -- The full size image is a re-use of the artist's work, the same graphic used on the flag image. the smaller one, i cannot tell if it was derived from an approvable source or if it is a repost, but its definitely unnecessary as the wiki just needs one size of image. if we need an icon, we can write the code of the regular image with an icon size parameter, so no need for a smaller set -- Captain MKB 22:46, February 13, 2017 (UTC)


  • Just to make it more complicated, we also have these images of the Terran Empire's symbol:
  • The second image is a clear repeat of the .SVG file I listed in the first posting.I only think we need one of those two and I do agree with you Mike, the icon size is unneeded. But what do we do with the other three images?--Long Live the United Earth (talk) 22:53, February 13, 2017 (UTC)
    • one is derived from the symbol seen on TOS, the other(s) are from ENT - both are needed but both can probably be found in the Encyclopedia or Technical manuals, giving us an esily citable valid image - hopefully for both TOS and ENT -- Captain MKB 23:30, February 13, 2017 (UTC)

Titan images[edit source]

Mike seems to have forgotten to say anything :P So to summarise, these images were uploaded by User:Turtleturtle93, and they were created by Star Trek: Titan author Geoffrey Thorne. These and further character illustrations from Titan in the style of a would-be animated version of the series can be found on Thorne's Sword of Damocles annotations blog. User:Columbia clipper has handily found out we have already been granted permission to use them.

So question is, should we use them (and potentially the other Thorne illustrations). As a general principle I think author created images are significantly preferable candidates for supplemental images to ones by our users; as they were created by the creators of the characters in question, and they know what they imagined while we can only interpret their descriptions. We also have precedent for this, we already have a few images by Christopher L. Bennett (Torvig Bu-Kar-Nguv, Orilly Malar and K'chak'!'op)

I see two potential problems. These images were created under the premise of them being stylised for a Titan animated series. This stylisation includes TNG tv era style uniforms, or variations there of, as well as a new combadge. While we know from the Titan novel covers these characters continue to wear the TNG movie era uniforms. Is that an acceptable inaccuracy?

The other issue is where we already have images from Titan covers and Bennett they offer very different interpretations compared to Thorne's versions, is this a problem? Having potentially two very different images illustrating the same thing? I think when we have a cover image we shouldn't use a supplemental image as well (so I don't think we should use the Aili Lavena submitted here), but when we have two conflicting author images it could get tricky.

Columbia Clipper has also already suggested we could use these, but only in the background sections of pages. I support this usage as a starting point, it seems entirely appropriate to include background on how an author envisions his characters. Though that does open a new issue; if we set that precedent should all character supplemental images be relegated to background sections? --8of5 04:57, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

I don't think that precedent would be set; these images are intentionally impressionistic (why the uniforms are non-standard). We should safely be able to integrate these images as background material while keeping images of more descriptive intent where they are. More directly: these pictures aren't meant to represent the Titan crew (main article); they're meant to represent what the Titan crew might look like in a hypothetical animated series (background).
I agree regarding Ali Lavenna and other characters who may appear on novel covers or in other official publications. -- Columbia clipper 23:25, July 31, 2010 (UTC)
Thinking about this a bit more, if we are only using these as background section images then I think we should include the characters we have existing images of, to give all the characters the same level of coverage in regard to this author's illustration project. --8of5 19:35, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
  • Yes, in background sections, excepting Ali Lavenna, Deanna Troi, Will Riker, Ree, and Tuvok. -- Columbia clipper 23:25, July 31, 2010 (UTC)
  • Yes, in background sections only. --8of5 19:35, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
  • Double vote: No' but if I am outvoted, then I must say background only with the lot of them. -- Captain MKB 21:37, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
    • I'd like to change my vote to yes for the characters who have never been pictured canonically or in licensed works. I maintain the vote of "no" for those that depict characters who already have depictions, as they are unnecessary. -- Captain MKB 02:29, May 27, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes--User:Not Spock/SpritesNot Spock User:Not Spock/Userboxes 13:25, September 7, 2010 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Nx1701g 22:53, September 11, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Sci 16:45 9 MAY 2012 UTC

Khan's flag[edit source]

Khan's banner.

Depiction of the banner used by the Khanate. This is an original illustration of a licensed topic, the logo was mentioned in in "Eugenics Wars" and "Section 31 DS9" -- this started out hand drawn and digitally colored based on a description derived from the novels. -- Captain MKB 01:48, April 17, 2011 (UTC)

Could you possibly quote the relevant parts of the texts you cited? (Sure you've done a grand job, but just to be sure) --8of5 18:29, May 26, 2011 (UTC)
From The Eugenics Wars: The Rise and Fall of Khan Noonien Singh, Volume 2:
A scarlet banner waved proudly from a flagpole atop the roof of the building, bearing the image of a silver crescent moon superimposed upon a bright golden sun. Khan had chosen the emblem personally. The sun and the moon together, symbolizing totality, everything in the world. All that he was fated to rule.
from Section 31: Abyss:
The round figure is the sun? [ ...] And that's a crescent moon superimposed on it?
It's an ancient symbol—almost 400 years old—the sun and the moon together, suggesting totality, everything in the world. It symbolized the rule of Khan Noonien Singh.
from The Eugenics Wars: To Reign in Hell: The Exile of Khan Noonien Singh
A crimson banner, bearing the image of a crescent moon superimposed upon a sun, fluttered from a flagpole rising from the center of the camp. The flag had been designed by Khan himself, Marla knew, during his reign on Earth 300 years ago. Together, the sun and moon symbolized totality—everything in the world, all that Khan had once intended to rule. Just as he now intended to rule Ceti Alpha V.
I used a common crescent and sun shape which, before my modifications, appears in -many- flags from the eastern hemisphere - to make this fit with the possibilities a leader might choose for heraldry in that era (the 1980s-1990s). There are some slightly different stylings possible from the description but i believed i've captured the overall look. -- Captain MKB 02:06, May 27, 2011 (UTC)
Looks spot on :) --8of5 20:36, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
  • yes -- Captain MKB 01:48, April 17, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes --8of5 20:36, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Cyfa 20:55, September 11, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Sci 16:45 9 MAY 2012 UTC

[edit source]

Vanguard logo.

Logo of The Vanguard. -- Captain MKB 23:29, September 11, 2011 (UTC)

  • yes -- Captain MKB 23:29, September 11, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes. After all, it looks like the logo from the screen-shot. -- Cyfa 21:03, September 12, 2011 (UTC)
  • Yes -- Sci 16:45 9 MAY 2012 UTC

File:Seal of United Earth.svg and File:Flag of United Earth.svg[edit source]

Seal of United Earth.svg created by Gav236

Flag of United Earth.svg created by Gav236

If we're going by the standards the community established in 2006 -- that we would vote to approve or deny original images of subjects that had never appeared in a canonical or licensed Star Trek source -- these images really shouldn't even need to be approved, because they're clearly just copies of the U.E. seal and flag seen in ENT episodes: "Home", "Terra Prime". But we should absolutely keep these images -- they're really lovely images, the flag one is based on prior work from this community in determining what the U.E. flag looks like, and they're much "cleaner" than any other U.E. seal or flag graphics I've seen or than screencaps could be. -- Sci 16:39 9 MAY 2012 UTC

  • Yes -- Sci 16:39 9 MAY 2012 UTC
  • no - due to concerns over accuracy of image. -- Captain MKB 16:47, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

Discussion[edit source]

The reason we need to discuss approval is the relative quality of the images. there are two other UE flag images for example, and the shapes and delineation is superior (more accurate) in those versions, based on how they were seen in canon.

Do you understand? These user-made .SVG versions are less accurate to canon than the other .JPG or .PNG versions. Therefore they don't exactly match what's seen onscreen. Hence this discussion. -- Captain MKB 16:47, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

It's the same image that's been accepted on Memory Alpha's United Earth page, and I don't see any inaccuracies from the canonical seal image. -- Sci 17:23 9 MAY 2012 UTC

Gold Family Tree[edit source]

Yet another oldie. We have a family tree of the Gold-Gilman family that was created and uploaded by 8of5 in 2007. I think its legitimate image to keep around, but it was never brought up for an official vote and needs approved. --Long Live the United Earth (talk) 05:33, February 12, 2017 (UTC)

Gold tree.jpg


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